Dr Scott Allen of the “Phronesis” podcast interviews me about my research into leadership in professional organizations. In a relaxed and quite personal discussion we talk in depth about my research and how my work on collective leadership has developed. We also talk about:

• How I became an academic who works closely with practitioners.
• Leaders I have known: Chess players vs. shape shifters.
• Power, politics, and populist leaders in times of crisis.
• My podcast: How I make it, and my favourite episodes.
• Disrupting academia and avoiding “intellectual junk food”.

Listen to the podcast here. The interview with me starts at minute 1:40.